Dueling Speakers: Meet the DJ who has been hired to mix it up with the Black Israelites outside Liberty Place

A Q&A with the DJ who has been hired to counter the Black Israelites' street preaching outside Liberty Place.

PLAY THAT FUNKY MUSIC: Since last summer, Eric Pawlicki has been hired about 20 times to mix it up outside Liberty Place. He is shown here during a gig in November.
Patrick Rapa

At 16th and Chestnut one Friday this month, the Black Israelites were losing a battle with Rihanna. And they were not happy about it. The Black Israelites are formally known as the Israelite School of Universal Practical Knowledge, and informally known as those dudes who use their PA system to yell slurs about white people, Asians, gays, interracial couples, women they perceive to be dressed provocatively and pretty much everyone walking by. They are rated as a hate group by the Southern Poverty Law Center. 

After a legal battle last summer, Common Pleas Judge Ellen Ceisler ruled that because the Black Israelites were protesting peacefully, they were protected by the First Amendment and could not be kicked off public property — the sidewalk — by Liberty Place shop owners. “If a Neo-Nazi protested in front of my synagogue on Yom Kippur,” she said, “they would not be arrested.”

The strange, ongoing audial battle on the corner is due to Liberty Place’s Plan B: hiring a DJ to set up about 20 feet away on the other side of the public-private property divide, directly facing the protesters, to play pop music as loud as he’s permitted. When the protesters have their permits in order, that means “not so loud you completely drown them out,” with levels enforced by civil-affairs officers. That particular Friday, though, the permits were not in order, and the volume escalation on both sides made conversation impossible. The DJ seemed surprisingly upbeat as he was personally called a white devil a couple dozen times in just the 10 minutes I was there. It was far too loud to talk at the time, but I got in touch with him later. Eric Pawlicki, of New Jersey company DJ’s Available, spoke with City Paper about having the city’s weirdest turntable gig. (He’d like to make it clear that he doesn’t speak for his employer or Liberty Place; this is just his personal experience.) Here’s a condensed version of the interview — you can find the whole thing, plus videos CP shot of the day described and that Pawlicki has shot, online at citypaper.net.

City Paper: So, how did you get this gig?

Eric Pawlicki: Liberty Place has the protesters there, which you saw, and basically they hired my company to turn a negative into a positive by playing some music and trying to drown them out a little bit. It got pretty intense Friday [Jan. 17]; some people got into an altercation with them, tipping over their signs, stuff like that. … People are walking by and they’re calling them names, saying the most crazy stuff.

CP: What instructions did you get on your first day?

EP: It’s as simple as it looks — you set up and you play music so when people walk by, they’re not just hearing a bunch of people screaming and yelling. These guys get really loud; they literally pick people out of the crowd and disrespect them.

CP: You’re probably one of the few people who’s really listened to these guys for more than a couple minutes; what’s your impression of their message?

EP: Uh … well, the message that they’re trying to put out is … I don’t want to even say hatred toward all white people — but, literally, a white person will walk by and they’ll look at him and call him a white devil, or they’ll look at the crowd and say, “I hope every white person here gets cancer and dies on their way home.” They’re cursing, they’re throwing stuff, they have their signs with Jesus on them and they throw them on the ground and stomp on them. I mean, you really have to go there and sit there all day while they’re doing this — it’s really unbelievable. It’s basically hate. It’s racism, that’s what it is. 

And it offends all kinds of people — very rarely does anyone stop to listen to what they’re saying. Just Friday, a black guy kicked over their signs; he was screaming at the protesters, “You’re giving our people a bad name!” … Because [the Black Israelites are] saying, “Black people, why are you letting white people do this to you? Your government is completely destroying you, we’re like slaves.” That’s what they preach, that they are slaves. And that all black people are slaves.

CP: Would you call this a good gig?

EP: I do enjoy it. But sometimes they do get under my skin, I gotta tell you. Sometimes they look over at me and talk directly to me and try to get under my skin. “Look at that DJ — tall, blond hair, you’re the devil! They’re paying him to come out here and stop us from preaching our word because they don’t want you to know the truth!” Some of that stuff can get really hard to deal with. But at the end of the day, you have to laugh.

I can’t tell you how many people come up and thank me for what I’m doing; people really do appreciate it, and that really makes me happy, makes me love what I’m doing while I’m there. So at the end of the day, I guess it’s a good gig.

CP: On Friday, it seemed like you were responding to what they were saying with specific songs.

EP: Oh yeah, absolutely, 100 percent. But when I play songs that look like they have something to do with the situation, a lot of the time it’s because citizens have walked up and asked me to play it. The number one request I get is Michael Jackson’s “Black or White.” It’s such a great song for [the situation] — everybody knows it, it’ll get people dancing. But it’s more for the people, not for the protesters. 

CP: You said Friday was crazier than usual — I heard that was because they didn’t have a permit?

EP: This was actually the first day that this happened — neither one of us had the permit. They [the Black Israelites] just came there around 10:30 in the morning, and I don’t start until 12. I was unaware of it, but one of their civil affairs officers came up to me and explained that how when they had a permit and we didn’t, it was right that their speaker was able to be louder. But then he mentioned that this time nobody had a permit, so it didn’t really matter. So the music went loud. [Laughs.] But that’s what people want! So many people walk by and give a thumbs-up, saying, “Turn it up, turn it up, turn it up!” So if we can get it louder, we’re going to go louder. It might sound immature, but at the end of the day, what they’re doing is completely wrong. It’s nonsense.

CP: When I was there Friday, I stuck around for a few songs, and it seemed like you had a dialogue going on. You played “Hit the Road, Jack” as they were packing up —

EP: [Laughs.] Oh, yeah, yeah.

CP: — and I believe in response to that they were calling you white boy, and you played “Play That Funky Music, White Boy.” 

EP: Oh yeah, absolutely.

CP: — and then they were calling you a devil, and you played “Running with the Devil.” Do you do that often?

EP: No, I don’t do that every week. “Hit the Road, Jack” — multiple people came up to me and asked me to put that on. I don’t regret doing it or anything, but it’s … I don’t want to say immature. But you know what? If I’m going to say something to them, if what they’re doing is going to get under my skin, the only way that I would consider getting back at them is through a song.